B5 / Crusade re-watch

[KoshN]

Originally Posted by Jan

It was definitely uneveen - JMS is the first to say so. Everything that happened was supposed to happen, just not necessarily in so compressed a fashion or to the people it happened to.

But I've never really understood why everybody hates the telepath arc so much and focuses in on their *hair*, of all things. <shrug> Oh, well, to each their own.

Well, Byron *did* spend as much time shoving his hair out of his eyes as Horatio Caine of "CSI:Miami" spent putting on and taking off his sunglasses. Byron was a thoroughly unlikeable ponce. Also, there's something about that character and that actor (as an actor) that I just DO NOT like. Can't put my finger on it. It's sort of a gut feeling.

When he and his teeps were gone, the season got massively better. Never was I so happy to see a character go. The only other ones that come close would have been Dr. Smith in "Lost in Space" (TV show), Horatio Caine and Delko in "Rio" in "CSI: Miami" and Indira Varma (as Ilsa Pucci) in "Human Target" Season 2.

[KoshN]

Originally Posted by JoeD80

They changed the look of the PPG bursts a few times, before going back to the way they looked in "Soul Hunter."

The look of the Season 1 thru Crusade PPG bursts NEVER bothered me. I always thought they looked fine. However, the paddle-rifle (like you used to get paddled with in the old days, in school and at home, when parents and teachers were WISELY allowed to discipline children.)/flat pistol/pong (white ball of light)/pong sound, weapons they used in "The Gathering" always look hokey/cheesey to me.

[Ubik]

Originally Posted by KoshN

Well, Byron *did* spend as much time shoving his hair out of his eyes as Horatio Caine of "CSI:Miami" spent putting on and taking off his sunglasses. Byron was a thoroughly unlikeable ponce. Also, there's something about that character and that actor (as an actor) that I just DO NOT like. Can't put my finger on it. It's sort of a gut feeling.

When he and his teeps were gone, the season got massively better. Never was I so happy to see a character go. The only other ones that come close would have been Dr. Smith in "Lost in Space" (TV show), Horatio Caine and Delko in "Rio" in "CSI: Miami" and Indira Varma (as Ilsa Pucci) in "Human Target" Season 2.

Yep... Couldn't agree more. The premise of the that mini teep arc was fine, but the execution was a bit shoddy. Would have been better if they could have drawn it out and made it more neuanced, perhaps use it to explore Bester and his past some more. But yes, Byron and his floppy hair definitely didn't help matters.

[OmahaStar]

Remember Byron.

[KoshN]

Originally Posted by OmahaStar

Remember Byron.

Can't. Lyta took care of that for me.

[JoeD80]

Huh, in the rewatch I am currently doing for myself I just happened to watch "Phoenix Rising" this very morning. It really is a well-done episode IMO; lots of good scenes, and the Byron/Bester stuff actually does go into a bit of their background too. Seeing Byron trying his hardest to keep his Telepath colony together and then having to be the one to shoot and save Garibaldi was a good arc, considering he was the one who said he was better than the mundanes by not being violent. Also we get the revelation that he used to be Bester's protege. I don't think Byron is supposed to be a character we entirely sympathize with. Also the scene with Garibaldi trying to shoot Bester and being told he's been "hit with an Asimov" as Bester calmly pours a drink is classic.

[Ubik]

Originally Posted by KoshN

Can't. Lyta took care of that for me.

Those neural blocks are gonna be hard to remove. What if you want to watch the beginning of season 5? No matter how much you want to, you won't be able to get that DVD in the player.

[Garibaldi's Hair]

Originally Posted by Ubik

Yep... Couldn't agree more. The premise of the that mini teep arc was fine, but the execution was a bit shoddy. Would have been better if they could have drawn it out and made it more neuanced, perhaps use it to explore Bester and his past some more. But yes, Byron and his floppy hair definitely didn't help matters.

The original plan had been to overlap seasons 4 and 5 by introducing the teep colony during the second half of season 4, and not ending the earth civil war arc until a few episodes into season 5, but being told to wrap the show at the end of season 4 forced JMS to change those two thing and separate season 5 out from season 4 completely.

It also wasn't helped by an overzealous maid throwing away JMS' season 5 notes at the same Blackpool hotel where the Claudia Christian storm had just hit.

All in all, season 5 didn't enjoy the best of starts ...

[WorkerCaste]

Originally Posted by KoshN

Well, Byron *did* spend as much time shoving his hair out of his eyes as Horatio Caine of "CSI:Miami" spent putting on and taking off his sunglasses. Byron was a thoroughly unlikeable ponce. Also, there's something about that character and that actor (as an actor) that I just DO NOT like. Can't put my finger on it. It's sort of a gut feeling.

I can't speak to the actor because I really only saw him as Byron (Moran doesn't really count -- too little to evaluate), but I think the whole point of Byron was to be unlikeable and to make you uneasy. Some of the things he says are true, and some of the things he advocates make sense, but he is an extremeist.

My biggest complaint with the telepath arc has always been that it feels largely unconnected, and I think that would have been mitigated if Ivanova was still around. Lyta herself was loosely bound to the main story at that point -- a supporting character rather than a main one. That leaves the story kind of hanging there. The telepath movie might have helped, too, but the whole thing just kind of dangles there, now.

[Marsden]

Originally Posted by KoshN

Byron was a thoroughly unlikeable ponce. Also, there's something about that character and that actor (as an actor) that I just DO NOT like. Can't put my finger on it. It's sort of a gut feeling.

I used to feel that way, too. Then after the fact I found out he was Moran and I had no problem with him at all in that role. I like the show/story more than who's in it and I didn't realize it was him but his voice sounded familiar which made me look at the credits and then I saw it was him. If I saw it the other way around I might have felt differently. I think it was his good acting ability that made him so damn unlikeable.

Originally Posted by KoshN

The look of the Season 1 thru Crusade PPG bursts NEVER bothered me. I always thought they looked fine. However, the paddle-rifle (like you used to get paddled with in the old days, in school and at home, when parents and teachers were WISELY allowed to discipline children.)/flat pistol/pong (white ball of light)/pong sound, weapons they used in "The Gathering" always look hokey/cheesey to me.

The rifle looked like a vacuum attachment and the pistols like dustbusters. Other than that, I didn't mind too much. The PPGs in all incarnations were much better. The echoing or "pong" sound was consistent with a hollow plastic tube, kind of like wacking the vacuum hose against something, so... when Garibaldi said he was going to "clean up Babylon 5" he wasn't kidding.

BTW, I just want to say I'm really enjoying this thread, what ever the topic is supposed to be.

I just reread To Dream In the City of Sorrows, I really recommend it, just because it really does answer some questions, even if you didn't actually have them before they were answered. My question was, Where did all of these Human Rangers come from if it's a Minbari institution and many of the Minbari, especially the warriors, didn't seem to like Humans.

One last note, the power rings are mentioned in the Centauri Trilogy, not piviotal to the plot, but G'kar remembers that incident, it stuck with him, as one would think having your body crushed by gravity would. I always though that the Minbari gravity mastery was just that good. If you look at their ships, they don't have engines. They just move. Even the Centauri ships have engines, even though they, too, have gravity control, it's not as good as the Minbari. Fighters, excepted from that, but the fighters didn't seem to have the gravity system, either.